valm41

Wizard
Platform
PC, Steam
Crafting without the cash shop items takes up by far the majority of the game. Just to go from level 50-51 took two days, a few hours each day, and that was just one crafting job. I can already see the time is just going to get a lot worse as I will need to go from 50-95. I'm forced to spend more time crafting then playing the game. Meanwhile with cash shop items I went from 40-50 in seconds. The gap between free to play and pay to win must come closer. I don't mind spending a little, but this game charges to much. Until they allow players to get by with just playing the game, this game will continue to be a dead garbage game. Only due to the greedy cash shop practices, and game mechanics that forced players into the cash shop. This game is fun to play, but due to the greed of the developers of the game, this game is not a game that can be played for to long, the paywall smacks the player in the face and you either pay or quit. Seeing how to many play this fun game, it's clear many have chosen to quit. Sorry to rant, but it sucks having to think about quitting a fun game do to a very high paywall.
 

Ekimie

Hunter
Royal Guardian
Platform
Steam
There is no paywall, because you can achieve everything by not paying. I'm pretty sure you are referring to motes, and those can be both bought from vendors for gold and found during gathering. You can even buy them from other players for gold. Sure, without it goes slower, but that's dosing your motes. If you want to achieve everything within seconds, get alllll the levels without putting in time, then the Devs can't help that either. I've leveled all crafting to 95 without buying motes. Yeah, it takes time. But wasting time is the exact reason I play a game, if I wanted to do something useful there is plenty laundry to do. But I prefer fun
 

Majenta

Villager
Forum Moderator
Platform
PC
To address the crafting issue first, as mentioned above, motes can be purchased from vendors in game for gold. There is a mote vendor in Ardent City at the foot of the statue in the centre of the crafting area. Other vendors in various zones also sell them. The price varies from vendor to vendor, and which is currently the cheapest changes with each patch, so it is worth "shopping around" so to speak. Sadly, all too often the cheapest motes are in zones like Rye which many crafters can't access, but c'est la vie.

One thing which can actually have a surprisingly large effect on the time taken to craft is the rank of the crafting stations in your village. Characters that either have no house or are in an undeveloped village will craft just 20 items a minute, rising to 24 with village insight active. By contrast, a developed village gives 33 rising to 40 (I think). Add the crafting tools from the item shop (a far, far better way to spend crowns than wasting them on motes) and that becomes 50 items a minute, rising to 60 with village insight.

Turning to the issue regarding sockets, the game actually gives you over 100 sockets for free by the time you reach level 95, counting the 50 from the new character calendar, 28 from achievements for levelling, 14 from making elder gear, and 18 from Ginny and the Cronk Island quests (assuming you repeat them each rebirth). In addition to that, the gnogmenting achievements give a further total of 23 (granted few players do all those) the monthly calendar gives you another 2 every month, Zog achievements add another 5 and there are further sockets given for "hidden" elements such as in Spire and finally events such as Sugarsweet give "seasonal" sockets as well.

As a low level player, you out level gear very quickly, so there is really no need to fully socket everything until much later in the game, but the prevalent concept that you shouldn't use sockets at all (which reinforces the idea that they represent a "paywall" when they really don't) is ridiculous. New players are struggling along with just 3 feats on weapons, getting bored and leaving the game because we, the experienced players, are telling them that they "should" be able to max with just three feats. Seriously, why are we telling new players they should grind along playing the game the most uninteresting way possible? What happened to the concept that a game is supposed to be fun? Even If I socket a full 7 feats onto a new weapon every ten levels, I'm still only using 36 sockets by level 90.

So even if you managed to max out a char with all 5 rebirths in a month, didn't make any elder gear but did at least claim the achievements for reaching each five level "tier" the first time, you have 42 unused sockets with which to make the perfect end game gear. Assuming the more realistic scenario whereby you have actually got some more sockets from the monthly calendar and making elder gear, made sure to claim the free sockets from Ginny and Rosamunda, plus picked up the odd one from zog achievements, gnogmenting achievements or Crystal Spire, that is actually going to be closer to 80 or 90.

We do the game a huge disservice by constantly telling new players not to use sockets until level 70 + or endgame. It feeds into a false narrative that V and H is "pay to win" which couldn't be further from the truth. Players are given more than enough free sockets to last the entire game, as long as they don't waste those sockets
 

Catori

Squirrel
Platform
PC
Crafting is also a part of the game. Yes crafting is slower leveling than combat. Many players enjoy both combat and crafting. Personally I’m in the game for the long haul (2011 from the start) and spend my time doing both at my own pace. I’ve always looked at this game as a journey that I am in no rush to complete. There are many days I come from a stressful job to play where I spend my time destressing from work by gathering/crafting to relax. I have never felt constricted by a “paywall” to progress as there isn’t one. There are items in the shop that can make the crafting side of the game faster, but there are also combat items offered too. None of those items offered are necessary to enjoyment and access to content. Most of those items are already offered in game as quest and calendar rewards for free. The community is quite amazing in its efforts to share and help those players who don’t enjoy both sides of the game. Our devs are also quite generous with shop items at many times. I’ve never considered them to approach this creation from a greedy standpoint. I can’t imagine a day without V&H and enjoy all the content provided in this game.
 

Antavious

Warrior
Characters
Antavious, suoivatna
Platform
iOS
Lol games like this take time it’s a normal part of any mmorpg paid or free (btw this is the latter)
Motes are for suckers/lazy people, sockets too I lvled my main to 95 did all my rb’s and all my crafting over the course of 1 year and I don’t/didn’t use motes or sockets except a few times (and I mean 1 or 2) still had 120+ sockets when I reached my lvl also consider my self gold rich.

oh and I am 100% ftp (I don’t like to admit that because irl I’m poor and the devs really do deserve my money)
 

ishanroyc

Warrior
Characters
ishanroyc, ishamanroyc
Platform
Android, PC
Crafting without the cash shop items takes up by far the majority of the game. Just to go from level 50-51 took two days, a few hours each day, and that was just one crafting job. I can already see the time is just going to get a lot worse as I will need to go from 50-95. I'm forced to spend more time crafting then playing the game. Meanwhile with cash shop items I went from 40-50 in seconds. The gap between free to play and pay to win must come closer. I don't mind spending a little, but this game charges to much. Until they allow players to get by with just playing the game, this game will continue to be a dead garbage game. Only due to the greedy cash shop practices, and game mechanics that forced players into the cash shop. This game is fun to play, but due to the greed of the developers of the game, this game is not a game that can be played for to long, the paywall smacks the player in the face and you either pay or quit. Seeing how to many play this fun game, it's clear many have chosen to quit. Sorry to rant, but it sucks having to think about quitting a fun game do to a very high paywall.
you can just buy cash shop items for gold from people who sell cash shop items occasionally, though everything in game can be done for free, but if you do buy cash shop items for gold from a player, trade gold for the cash shop items in ardent or somewhere if you dont know them.
 

Zaphyra

Master Villager
Characters
Retired
Platform
Android, PC
Last edited
How to level-up gathering/crafting (without using cash-shop items):
  1. Search through all the open Villages and move to one that has the highest level crafting stations, to obtain Village crafting buffs (which will increase crafting speed and experience earned).
  2. Visit a Level 4 Village COG station (in your village or any village) and collect your free white/green/blue supplies, each day. Sell your whites for green or blue (to increase gathering speed and loot drops). Some players use green supplies on regular nodes and blues on plentiful nodes.
  3. Search your open maps for wild Plentiful nodes and gather every plenty you find. Vendor your gems and sell the mats you don't need in Trade Chat for 2-4g/350 (silkworms, ore, oil fish and wood usually sell for 3-4g... mushrooms, beetles and meat fish usually sell for 2-3g).
  4. Use the gold you earn gathering, to repair/replace tools and buy more gathering supplies. On US3, you may ask in Trade Chat, to buy stacks of 2500 Green supplies for 100-120g and 2500 Blue supplies for 250g. If no one is selling supplies in Trade Chat, check the AH and see if any are reasonably priced. If none are selling for reasonable prices, then visit the Mote Vendor in Ardent and buy COG Coins, which you may use at the COG Quartermaster, to buy more gathering supplies. NEVER buy supplies from the Crown Shop or Charter vendor, they're too expensive.
  5. Save your free gathering/crafting elixirs and clockwork harvesters. Only use them, when you have enough gathering supplies or raw mats, to gather or craft for the full duration of your buffs. Also use Verda Sprouts, Traids, Pies, Gobazollas and any other stackable buffs, while gathering/crafting.
  6. You may find Arachnamassers, while gathering bugs... these are the free version of clockwork harvesters... use them to speed your gathering or sell them for 50s/charge (ie, a 10 charge arachnamasser, will sell for 5g).
  7. You will find motes while gathering... use them to speed your crafting (while using buffs) or sell them for up to 85g/1000 (because they can be bought from Traveling Vendors for 88-89g/1000).
  8. If you can't find wild Plentiful nodes, gather from Village nodes and collect Cornucopia. When you have 30 Cornys, ask if anyone will make you an Overflowing Cornucopia (many players will convert your Cornys for free, some will charge crafting cost of about 11-15s each). Use your Overflowing Cornucopia to gather more motes or sell them for about 15-20g each.
  9. You may refine silkworms, ore, oil fish and wood, for free crafting experience. Refines may be used to craft useful items or sold to other players for 7-12g/stack (some players will pay up to 12g, because they don't need the crafting experience and don't want to use expensive motes to refine their own mats).
  10. Donate extra raw mats or refines to Village Projects and/or the Wellspring, for extra gathering/crafting experience.
  11. Sell extra raw mats or refines to the Charter Vendor and buy Skill Books with Charter, for extra gathering/crafting experience.
  12. Crafting level-appropriate gear and consumables, will not only give you more experience than refining... it will also give you items that will make your character stronger, allowing you to participate in more content, as you level-up... AND you may save and reuse your items, during the rebirth process. Craft at least 30 of any gear/weapon, to master (or 5 star) the recipe and you'll begin crafting rare/blue gear, which may be enhanced to epic/purple. You may then add preparations, to make your gear even stronger. A full set of level-appropriate epic/purple gear/weapons... will allow you to participate in Raids, Ladders and solo most maps.
  13. Kill Bounties every day, to activate and maintain your Villager buff at "75" (I forgot the name, but you'll see the buff in your list, when it's active).
Continue doing all of the above and you will steadily level-up your gathering/crafting and combat... and you'll earn more gold from gathering, as you level-up and begin finding high level plentiful nodes.

As far as gnogging goes... I think you may gnog 2-3 runes onto each piece of gear and 3 feats + 1 reinforcement rune on your weapon (for free). So choose the best runes from your crafted gear/weapons (fyi: the more you craft an item, the higher level your runes will become... the strongest runes will be 4 levels above your item, so choose your runes wisely). If you want to save your sockets, then only add free runes to your gear... and only spend sockets, to add extra feats to your weapons. IMHO, the extra feats are well worth the sockets and you'll probably be able to buy more sockets from crown sellers, later in the game (when you're earning more gold).

Everything in this post may be done FASTER if you purchase an Ardent Society membership and Crown items... but it can also be done for FREE, if you're willing to grind and use your resources wisely. :geek:(y)
 

IrishElf

Citizen
Forum Moderator
Platform
PC
The other thing to note is that many people don't craft at all. Crafting is great to have, but a lot of people just buy their stuff from crafters.
 
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Giruv

Merchant
Royal Guardian
Characters
Verrier
Platform
PC
I think both side of the argument have merit, even tho socket, mote, premium tools, etc, not a big pay wall, the game can be much better without them.
 

valm41

Wizard
Platform
PC, Steam
This games biggest problem is that it tied skills to sockets. The gears that drop only have 1-3 free sockets, that is far from being enough. Most skills come from the gear themselves. So each time you have to level gear you also have to re-socket them, otherwise trying to survive with just 1-3 skills is impossible the higher you get. So the game forces you to depend on sockets. The game itself doesn't provide nearly enough sockets, so you are forced to either keep dying to the point you can't move forward or buy sockets from the cash shop so you can actually have enough skills in your hot bar to get by.
 

sirbabbo

Warrior
Platform
iOS
This games biggest problem is that it tied skills to sockets. The gears that drop only have 1-3 free sockets, that is far from being enough. Most skills come from the gear themselves. So each time you have to level gear you also have to re-socket them, otherwise trying to survive with just 1-3 skills is impossible the higher you get. So the game forces you to depend on sockets. The game itself doesn't provide nearly enough sockets, so you are forced to either keep dying to the point you can't move forward or buy sockets from the cash shop so you can actually have enough skills in your hot bar to get by.

Done this for 2 years and they best thing to do is see how you can make the system work in your favor. Weapons have 3 free skill slots, and armor pieces have 2 support rune slots... Weapons only need 2 or at most 3 sockets used!!Armor need 0 to have a good set!!
So if I craft a belt thirty times I get the best support runes from here on out. If I craft 2 belts and let’s say one belt has the 4 desired support runes I want, but not the stats and I have my second belt with 2 support runes but the desired stats, you can take the belt you want to keep as your base and transfer all 4 support stats over to that belt and take the 2 away. Thus makes 0 use of a socket.. if your not doing that then yeah wasting sockets away at lower levels.. for weapons, just need 5 skill spells since every sub class has one special spell unique to that class at 10 talent points. That’s 2 sockets and can go a little wild with another spell if you desire..
 

Antavious

Warrior
Characters
Antavious, suoivatna
Platform
iOS
This games biggest problem is that it tied skills to sockets. The gears that drop only have 1-3 free sockets, that is far from being enough. Most skills come from the gear themselves. So each time you have to level gear you also have to re-socket them, otherwise trying to survive with just 1-3 skills is impossible the higher you get. So the game forces you to depend on sockets. The game itself doesn't provide nearly enough sockets, so you are forced to either keep dying to the point you can't move forward or buy sockets from the cash shop so you can actually have enough skills in your hot bar to get by.
This statement is just flat out untrue, maybe read a few of the responses and keep it respectful as it’s starting to border on slander
 

Majenta

Villager
Forum Moderator
Platform
PC
Just a reminder to all posters to please keep their posts polite and on topic.
 

valm41

Wizard
Platform
PC, Steam
Last edited
This statement is just flat out untrue, maybe read a few of the responses and keep it respectful as it’s starting to border on slander
You say it's untrue? Then enlighten me on the truth. What did I say that is wrong? Gears come with 1-3 sockets, it's all I have ever seen. Most my mage skills come from the gears themselves. Is this a lie? If I'm wrong that would be a game changer for me. Tell me which npc sells mage skills or where to go to buy my mage skills? If you have no real opinion and you replied without even reading or thinking first then, well, that would be pretty sad to claim slander when you yourself are the slanderer.
 

Antavious

Warrior
Characters
Antavious, suoivatna
Platform
iOS
Right facts, you are wrong about there being any kinda pay wall. I think most of your problems can be fixed by reading some of the great advice offered by the players in this thread.

So as far as I can see you have two options.

1. Read the posts and rise to the challenge
Or
2. Accept this isn’t the game for you and move on
 

ishanroyc

Warrior
Characters
ishanroyc, ishamanroyc
Platform
Android, PC
You say it's untrue? Then enlighten me on the truth. What did I say that is wrong? Gears come with 1-3 sockets, it's all I have ever seen. Most my mage skills come from the gears themselves. Is this a lie? If I'm wrong that would be a game changer for me. Tell me which npc sells mage skills or where to go to buy my mage skills? If you have no real opinion and you replied without even reading or thinking first then, well, that would be pretty sad to claim slander when you yourself are the slanderer.
you can gnogment upto 3 runes on your staff for free...pick and choose..dont just equip any gear , customize it!
 
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