Joleen

BRA Member
Royal Guardian
Characters
Kavita, Katona, Chephirah
Platform
Android, PC
Since my return to the game I've been really aggravated with the runes, and the reason why is because it's too random. What I am experiencing is that as I level and require new gear, I am doomed to either losing runes I love, or beg, borrow, or scour the AH (which only seems to have EARTH shaman gear in it). What is happening to me, and others is a disappointing trade-off - and it goes something like this:

"I have this lovely new lvl 26 legendary axe that Oober made for me, it's lovely and has beautiful stats, but, of course it needs runes. I have very limited, storage space so I cannot hoard dropped items with the runes I like on them, PLUS I cannot go into the areas I need to go into without the new weapon but the new weapon needs runes, and it needs the particular runes that I like which I cannot find for the life of my toon, literally."

Years ago a very wise supervisor of mine taught me to never complain until I have thought up at least one solution to the problem, so here goes... please don't destroy me, this is just one possible solution to the problem.

What if we could craft the runes we want? Either using existing craft stations, OR a special craft station just for creating runes. I would personally be glad to take the time to make the runes I want for my gear at specific levels rather than running around like I did yesterday searching for the runes I want and ending the day disappointed. I would love an addition like rune creating as long as it didn't involve massive amounts of material that the average player doesn't have room for.

I didn't go into great detail with this idea because I really don't like wasting my time on ideas that the devs or other players would hate, but if the devs felt this was a good idea I'm sure others including myself would be glad to contribute any ideas.

So, what do you all think? Is this doable? Is there any reason we couldn't do something like this in the future?
 

dustbunny

Squirrel
Platform
iOS, PC
I will say, most of us hate the randomness of the runes. It has been asked if it would be possible for us to have more control over what runes we can get. But, for some reason, it seems that having randomness is suppose to equals fun. Never seen that myself, it mostly equals big time frustration for most players. The thought I heard one time is, we are suppose to be "happy" when we finally get the item we need. I don't think that is how most people feel.
 

Majenta

Villager
Forum Moderator
Platform
PC
It may be wishful thinking on my part, or simply bad memory, but I have a vague recollection that way back when Starfall was first mooted, and the idea of runes was first mentioned, that there was at that time a suggestion from the Devs of exactly what you suggest - that players would be able to craft runes, not just actual weapons etc.

What happened to the idea in the meantime I have no idea, but certainly seems like it would be a good plan.

Then again, as far as I am concerned, anything which reduces the absurd level of randomness in acquiring the gear you want would be beneficial.
 

Joleen

BRA Member
Royal Guardian
Characters
Kavita, Katona, Chephirah
Platform
Android, PC
Exactly, and enough frustration for some players just means they end up quitting, which is NOT what we want. What gamers like is feeling god-like, run faster, jump higher, and reach the very sky itself. Pandering and begging for runes ... meh. lol
 
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Characters
Tiffa, Ruby Wolf
Platform
Android, PC
I agree that being able to craft some runes would be Great. I believe in and like randomness in Role playing games (Long time D&D / D20 player where everything is random dice rolls), because it add a little spice in the game, but to much can ruin the fun. I think having a greater chance of getting the proper sub-class items need to be added (my suggested drop rate for Items = 40% item is right sub class, 30% other sub-class, 30% any other class) to make the game a little more fun, but still keeping it random.
As for getting the opposite cub-class at rebirths, I think that it is intensional so that you will try the other sub-class instead of just playing the same one.
 
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Littlenymph

Squirrel
Characters
Layla Littlenymph
Platform
PC, Steam
There are things I love about this game.
There are things I like about this game.
There are things I am ambivalent about in this game.
There are things I dislike about this game.
And then...
There are things I actually hate about this game.

Make no mistake; the "things I hate" is a very small list that is far outweighed by the things I love and like, but at the very top of that list in its proper place of [dis]honor, sits the King of all things I have ever hated in this game. And his name is...
Randomness, High King of Frustration!
OFF WITH HIS HEAD!
 

KAVE

Adventurer
Royal Guardian
Characters
See Signature
Platform
PC
I'll reiterate my thoughts on RNG: "I'd rather spend hours constructing a single perfect piece of equipment than hours assembling various imperfect items"

Judging by the responses to this thread it is apparent that many share the OP's sentiment. Personally, I feel that RNG has its place, but it should not be the very crux of the gear system.

Looted gear? The type, class, rarity, runes, rune power levels and stat combinations are all based on RNG.
Crafted gear? The stats, runes and rune power levels are all based on RNG.

I'm not motivated to customize my gear when I may spend time, resources and gold acquiring a product I do not desire. Don't even get me started on the Zorian stones. Thus, the question is: How do you create a gear system that focuses on customization without making it so easy to construct your desired gear that the process becomes trivial?

For example, if I could simply select all of the runes I wanted straight from the crafting bench, I would have all of my gear ready within an hour. That may seem appealing at first glance, but think about it in the long term. MMOs are generally focused on gear progression. So, the gear framework needs to support that. This is why so much of our current system revolves around RNG. It keeps players busy and makes a relatively simple process into a complicated one. It serves its purpose, but at the expense of player fulfillment. Let's be real, no one feels triumph after acquiring that one special rune or drop - they only feel a sense of relief (finally it's over!).

All of this boils down to the fact that a solid foundation for a gear system follows a..... layer structure!! In the layer system, RNG is the top layer, otherwise known as the icing on the cake. It's not required, but it is there for those who wish to grind for incremental perks.

Here's a quick example: Say you could craft which rune you want straight away. The actual value of the rune has some slight variance though. So, if you want the highest possible stats for your rune, you'll have to grind for it. This is where RNG comes into play. For those who simply want the rune itself they can stop right away. For the min-maxers, they've got their luck-based fix which will keep them busy for a while longer. They'll earn a small benefit for their work as well.

We can apply the same concept to loot too. Rather than having to farm for our necessary spells, it would be much more interesting and less frustrating to farm for Gear Set Artifacts or something of the same token. Basically, when you kill an Elder Boss it has a chance to provide you with one of these artifacts. These can be applied onto a piece of gear. If you collect multiple pieces of the 'set' then you earn a set bonus. The more pieces you get, the greater the bonus. Mix and match different sets to run multiple bonuses at once. Nothing game-changing or overpowering! Just simple proc-based effects such as: "Spells have an X% chance to void their mana cost when the player is below 500 mana"

This gives combat players something to grind for as well, without requiring all players to constantly grind to replace their staple abilities every 5 levels. I could even see an increasing chance to obtain the artifact every time you slay the Elder. The first kill you have a 0.1% chance, the next kill you have a 0.2% chance, and so on and so forth until eventually you acquire the artifact. Then your chance reverts back to the default. This means even players with the worst luck will eventually get their artifact so long as they continue to try.
 

Joleen

BRA Member
Royal Guardian
Characters
Kavita, Katona, Chephirah
Platform
Android, PC
I'll reiterate my thoughts on RNG: "I'd rather spend hours constructing a single perfect piece of equipment than hours assembling various imperfect items"

Judging by the responses to this thread it is apparent that many share the OP's sentiment. Personally, I feel that RNG has its place, but it should not be the very crux of the gear system.

Looted gear? The type, class, rarity, runes, rune power levels and stat combinations are all based on RNG.
Crafted gear? The stats, runes and rune power levels are all based on RNG.

I'm not motivated to customize my gear when I may spend time, resources and gold acquiring a product I do not desire. Don't even get me started on the Zorian stones. Thus, the question is: How do you create a gear system that focuses on customization without making it so easy to construct your desired gear that the process becomes trivial?

For example, if I could simply select all of the runes I wanted straight from the crafting bench, I would have all of my gear ready within an hour. That may seem appealing at first glance, but think about it in the long term. MMOs are generally focused on gear progression. So, the gear framework needs to support that. This is why so much of our current system revolves around RNG. It keeps players busy and makes a relatively simple process into a complicated one. It serves its purpose, but at the expense of player fulfillment. Let's be real, no one feels triumph after acquiring that one special rune or drop - they only feel a sense of relief (finally it's over!).

All of this boils down to the fact that a solid foundation for a gear system follows a..... layer structure!! In the layer system, RNG is the top layer, otherwise known as the icing on the cake. It's not required, but it is there for those who wish to grind for incremental perks.

Here's a quick example: Say you could craft which rune you want straight away. The actual value of the rune has some slight variance though. So, if you want the highest possible stats for your rune, you'll have to grind for it. This is where RNG comes into play. For those who simply want the rune itself they can stop right away. For the min-maxers, they've got their luck-based fix which will keep them busy for a while longer. They'll earn a small benefit for their work as well.

We can apply the same concept to loot too. Rather than having to farm for our necessary spells, it would be much more interesting and less frustrating to farm for Gear Set Artifacts or something of the same token. Basically, when you kill an Elder Boss it has a chance to provide you with one of these artifacts. These can be applied onto a piece of gear. If you collect multiple pieces of the 'set' then you earn a set bonus. The more pieces you get, the greater the bonus. Mix and match different sets to run multiple bonuses at once. Nothing game-changing or overpowering! Just simple proc-based effects such as: "Spells have an X% chance to void their mana cost when the player is below 500 mana"

This gives combat players something to grind for as well, without requiring all players to constantly grind to replace their staple abilities every 5 levels. I could even see an increasing chance to obtain the artifact every time you slay the Elder. The first kill you have a 0.1% chance, the next kill you have a 0.2% chance, and so on and so forth until eventually you acquire the artifact. Then your chance reverts back to the default. This means even players with the worst luck will eventually get their artifact so long as they continue to try.
By god I love how you think! Thanks for putting into words what my old azz couldn't. <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 that's better than five stars, btw... :D
 

Greengo

Citizen
Characters
Greengo
Platform
PC
I want a rune SHOP .go buy what you WANT or the best you can afford. slot it and be able to remove it and reslot it into new gear as needed till it is outdated, then be able to SELL it. BOOM! an economy!
 
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Ekimie

Hunter
Royal Guardian
Platform
Steam
You aren't a very happy camper are you? I have yet to see a positive post from you. And I have seen MANY posts by you already. Lighten up a bit, it makes life so much brighter
 

Kaydee

Squirrel
Platform
PC
Hunting/grinding for something you need in order to progress: frustrating.
Doing the same kills over and over, cos there's something specific, you need: boring.
Finally getting the item you're looking for: relief.
Finding what you're looking for (like for a daily quest), after just a couple of quick kills: trepidation.
(cos you know, it'll be a long one again tomorrow...)
That about sums up what I think about random randomness.


I am only 1/8th Irish, and all I got from that, is my temper... :oops: :rolleyes: 🤭 (soz)
 
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Greengo

Citizen
Characters
Greengo
Platform
PC
You aren't a very happy camper are you? I have yet to see a positive post from you. And I have seen MANY posts by you already. Lighten up a bit, it makes life so much brighter
I think about how games cold work better. why is constructive criticism seen as a bad thing? I noticed ten years ago when I played that i was one of MANY voices echoing the same problems and criticism and they are all still her, not fixed or improved on, yet you/they want MONEY for a seriously flawed game. I bet the turnover rate is spectacular. people come, see this is just an endless grind and ridiculously complicated and hard and just give up and leave. doesn't HAVE to be that way. GOOD game devs try to find a way to make their games BETTER. I Am not the only one offering all these GREAT and FREE ideas. NO ONE is a genius who can think of how to build a perfect game, and who better than those who play to give you ideas on how to make it better. IT's so sad when devs just ignore all that input.

as i said elsewhere, if the game didn't have so much going for it, i would never bother to mention any problems. I'd just have played a day and left. In business, people who cant take criticism seldom succeed.
 

Pookey

Hunter
Characters
Pookey2
Platform
PC
I don’t think our devs ignore the input of the players. On the contrary I have seen player input being implemented many many times over the years. But please keep in mind that our ideas are not always feasible and also that a few supporters of an idea does not make that idea generally supported by all
Players.
 

Greengo

Citizen
Characters
Greengo
Platform
PC
I don’t think our devs ignore the input of the players. On the contrary I have seen player input being implemented many many times over the years. But please keep in mind that our ideas are not always feasible and also that a few supporters of an idea does not make that idea generally supported by all
Players.
that may ge so, but how about telling us why the ideas wont work? that would stop a lot of the endless repetitive asking for the same things from a whole heard of players. I bet most could be implemented with maybe only a little tweaking.
 

Bored dude

Citizen
Last edited
The rng, IMO is the only challenging combat aspect of this game. There aren’t any dodging mechanics, nor movement skills, targeted feats don’t miss and everything is linear. Without rng everything is already easy..It would get boring a lot faster, I think equipment fusing would be a fix in between too much grind and too easy, what my belief of equipment fusing is, you’re able to fuse two equipments, and it would reroll the equipment with new stats and runes, they have to be the same base rarity, type and same level. If I had to make 30 lv 95 legendary swords and none of them had the stats I wanted, I could instead of making more swords/salvaging more swords fuse them to help lower the cost/time for an additional chance.

This could be a specialization even.. the gnogmentation spec.
 
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