SprigOfHalcyon

Master Farmer
Royal Guardian
Platform
  1. Android
  2. PC
None of this compensates for the extreme damage loss which requires using skills more often to defeat the same enemies.

Let's not be overdramatic. I can still main tank and main heal a ladder run with no deaths and be the top DPS while using only blueberry mana potions for mana restoration, I just can't do it by as much anymore.

20230323Ladder - Copy.png
 
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SprigOfHalcyon

Master Farmer
Royal Guardian
Platform
  1. Android
  2. PC
OMG "95s are all that matter". Are you serious? 95s are SOOOOO EASY right now, the easiest thing I ever do. People are so good at it and there are so many good players cranking through it all the time. Almost any other activity is harder. FEEDING THE SHEEP IS HARDER THAN THE 95s! (Those entitled spoiled brats just ask for ANYTHING THEY WANT)

And by using that as a measuring stick, you aren't asking "is the class strong enough to DO all the content?" You're asking "Is this the strongest DPS class in the whole game right now?"

And what IS harder? running alongside a super stacked team that is SHREDDING the 95 elders every single day so fast it's hard to even target something before it's dead and run speed is the most important skill so that you can get some more gold because you have all the other rewards from the boss already? Or carrying a ragtag group through the ladder so they can get something they wouldn't have gotten otherwise?

My point is: shadow priest is still VERY strong and uses less mana than it did before. (While DEFINITELY being less damage, about 30% less is my guess, which I think was too much of a nerf, but a nerf was definitely needed.)

But... in any case, I did happen to find time to do the "Chinese 95s" and came in 5th on the charts. I don't consider this scientific, I'm sure there are plenty more than 4 people on the server who are higher DPS than I am and who knows if people were even trying their hardest. The enemy evaporated so fast, there wasn't time for much more than a handful of spells each group of mobs. I still remember when we were first trying to beat these elders and there were only 5 of us who had it unlocked and we were struggling just to get bronze. A DoT class definitely has some disadvantage when the length of the fight is so significantly smaller than the duration of the DoT.
20230324_95s_comb.png

Run speed/lack of lag was the deciding factor here I'm sure!!! (there were a total of 20 in the group, 5 more at the bottom of the chart I have left off)

I am also not meaning for this to be evidence that shadow priest does not need a "tweak up", I definitely think it does. The 40% detonation chance is just weird if it also gets rid of soul corrupter charges if only for the fact that you lose the shadow orbs DPS if you don't cast it due to timing. So, having the explosion just not add to soul corrupter (like it used to: 3 per curse exploded) seems like a sufficient nerf there. Explode chance, I just don't know. Even 60% makes it a little weird. Esp with lag, you need to make decisions one spell in advance, so when I cast shadow orbs, I am already casting my next spell, which is usually shadow bolt. But, there would be no point to casting shadow bolt again if shadow orbs didn't detonate. I think pre-patch, "in the world" (not raids), I was around 70%, so 60 isn't much worse, but it's like a 30% increase in times it doesn't detonate (going from 30% not detonate to 40% not detonate). Looking at it that way, it seems a lot more worse! :)
 
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Grz

Reader
Platform
  1. Android
My point is: shadow priest is still VERY strong and uses less mana than it did before. (While DEFINITELY being less damage, about 30% less is my guess, which I think was too much of a nerf, but a nerf was definitely needed.)
👏
Afaik, no one contests that Shadow was way ahead of the DPS curve before the mana patch and that the other dps classes had to catch up.
However... the way it was done was to take what was fun about it, to me -- the explosions that feel impactful! The change to 40% fixed detonation rate made the class ultra-boring. I had over 90% outside of raids before the patch so I felt the change from the more rousing Explosion-oriented to the boring DoT-oriented . So now I'm just applying all these curses that don't feel tiny bit impactful, darkfrost to see more damage numbers flying about, and occasionally explode them for big damage, if they crit, and I understand the crit part may be gone by next patch.

It was good that you found time to join the Chinese 95s because otherwise you'll easily top the Regular 95 elder run, then you'd be singing a different tune here.
 

SprigOfHalcyon

Master Farmer
Royal Guardian
Platform
  1. Android
  2. PC
It was good that you found time to join the Chinese 95s because otherwise you'll easily top the Regular 95 elder run, then you'd be singing a different tune here.

Go read my earlier posts, I've been saying the same thing the whole time.
 

SprigOfHalcyon

Master Farmer
Royal Guardian
Platform
  1. Android
  2. PC
Last edited
I had over 90% outside of raids before the patch

This is unbelievable. How? It was 40% and scaled with shadow power. You are claiming you had over +125% shadow power?
40% from talent, 35% from mastery? Where are you getting the other 50%? Adding berserk, flux, poise, and glory together gets close, but those are very dynamic and not 100% uptime.

(Edit: I think I made a mistake above, I think mastery has a soft cap at 25 not 35 (The tooltips used to tell you, but I can't see it anymore), but that's another 10% to account for)
 

Lalocat

Adventurer
Characters
Lalocat Vla Laniss
Platform
  1. Android
  2. PC
My point is: shadow priest is still VERY strong and uses less mana than it did before. (While DEFINITELY being less damage, about 30% less is my guess, which I think was too much of a nerf, but a nerf was definitely needed.)

30% is a huge difference. Dramatic even. And my mana is suffering more after the patch than before. 30% more? Yeah, something like that. I don't go for the top of the charts or max dps, I use well read cause I'm fairly casual (especially on priest - my third favorite toon) and like to be comfy and not worry about it. It's worse now. Not comfy.

Missing the explosions too.
 
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SprigOfHalcyon

Master Farmer
Royal Guardian
Platform
  1. Android
  2. PC
30% is a huge difference. Dramatic even. And my mana is suffering more after the patch than before. 30% more? Yeah, something like that. I don't go for the top of the charts or max dps, I use well read cause I'm fairly casual (especially on priest - my third favorite toon) and like to be comfy and not worry about it. It's worse now. Not comfy.

Missing the explosions too.

Gosh, not sure how mana is hurting worse, I'm using a TON fewer potions myself (and I only have "shadow weave" which I have for the vile echoes and don't run vampiric pact).

The only thing I can think would be perhaps if you recast DoTs that are already on the target?

The explosions having a higher chance sort of takes more mana because if it explodes, then you need to recast it. If it doesn't explode, then no point in recasting it and that "Saves" a lot of mana (although at the cost of a lot of damage!).
 

Ellusive

Priest
Characters
Ellusive
Platform
  1. iOS
These posts are feedback to report to Devs the issues players have with the changes, which is what the Devs asked for, they are not platforms to create arguments and tell everyone why they are wrong.
Stop with the constant rebuttals and listen to the community.
 
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Revlys

Legendary Hero
Platform
  1. iOS
OMG "95s are all that matter". Are you serious? 95s are SOOOOO EASY right now, the easiest thing I ever do. People are so good at it and there are so many good players cranking through it all the time. Almost any other activity is harder. FEEDING THE SHEEP IS HARDER THAN THE 95s! (Those entitled spoiled brats just ask for ANYTHING THEY WANT)

And by using that as a measuring stick, you aren't asking "is the class strong enough to DO all the content?" You're asking "Is this the strongest DPS class in the whole game right now?"

And what IS harder? running alongside a super stacked team that is SHREDDING the 95 elders every single day so fast it's hard to even target something before it's dead and run speed is the most important skill so that you can get some more gold because you have all the other rewards from the boss already? Or carrying a ragtag group through the ladder so they can get something they wouldn't have gotten otherwise?

My point is: shadow priest is still VERY strong and uses less mana than it did before. (While DEFINITELY being less damage, about 30% less is my guess, which I think was too much of a nerf, but a nerf was definitely needed.)

But... in any case, I did happen to find time to do the "Chinese 95s" and came in 5th on the charts. I don't consider this scientific, I'm sure there are plenty more than 4 people on the server who are higher DPS than I am and who knows if people were even trying their hardest. The enemy evaporated so fast, there wasn't time for much more than a handful of spells each group of mobs. I still remember when we were first trying to beat these elders and there were only 5 of us who had it unlocked and we were struggling just to get bronze. A DoT class definitely has some disadvantage when the length of the fight is so significantly smaller than the duration of the DoT.
View attachment 19176

Run speed/lack of lag was the deciding factor here I'm sure!!! (there were a total of 20 in the group, 5 more at the bottom of the chart I have left off)

I am also not meaning for this to be evidence that shadow priest does not need a "tweak up", I definitely think it does. The 40% detonation chance is just weird if it also gets rid of soul corrupter charges if only for the fact that you lose the shadow orbs DPS if you don't cast it due to timing. So, having the explosion just not add to soul corrupter (like it used to: 3 per curse exploded) seems like a sufficient nerf there. Explode chance, I just don't know. Even 60% makes it a little weird. Esp with lag, you need to make decisions one spell in advance, so when I cast shadow orbs, I am already casting my next spell, which is usually shadow bolt. But, there would be no point to casting shadow bolt again if shadow orbs didn't detonate. I think pre-patch, "in the world" (not raids), I was around 70%, so 60 isn't much worse, but it's like a 30% increase in times it doesn't detonate (going from 30% not detonate to 40% not detonate). Looking at it that way, it seems a lot more worse! :)
The only reason we were saying to check against 95s is because it’s a better test of actual dps. Raids and EZs are all altered to make players more equal. Basically it becomes an efficiency battle and not actual dps. I know many 75 dps classes that beat 95s in raids and ez. But when stacked against non balancing zones can’t hold a candle to the dps output of a 95.
 

SprigOfHalcyon

Master Farmer
Royal Guardian
Platform
  1. Android
  2. PC
The only reason we were saying to check against 95s is because it’s a better test of actual dps. Raids and EZs are all altered to make players more equal. Basically it becomes an efficiency battle and not actual dps. I know many 75 dps classes that beat 95s in raids and ez. But when stacked against non balancing zones can’t hold a candle to the dps output of a 95.

Yeah, things scale exponentially with level, doubling every 10 levels, it'd be pretty tough to keep up with a gap that large without the scaling. Basically, lvl 75 chars have their damage multiplied by 4 or so for scaled things.

This said, I've never seen a lvl 75 who is close. It's always a lvl that ends in 6 or 1 who's close. 6's and 1's get a crafted weapon at level and the crafted weapon runes are the most important thing for DPS.
 

Revlys

Legendary Hero
Platform
  1. iOS
I want to thank the Otters for a quick response to all of our concerns and look forward to seeing how things work after Mondays patch. Thank you.
 
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Grz

Reader
Platform
  1. Android
This is unbelievable. How? It was 40% and scaled with shadow power. You are claiming you had over +125% shadow power?
40% from talent, 35% from mastery? Where are you getting the other 50%? Adding berserk, flux, poise, and glory together gets close, but those are very dynamic and not 100% uptime.

(Edit: I think I made a mistake above, I think mastery has a soft cap at 25 not 35 (The tooltips used to tell you, but I can't see it anymore), but that's another 10% to account for)
🤭

It doesn't matter now.
 
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Big Lee

Citizen
Platform
  1. iOS
  2. Android
If we are inclined to use dot attacks, then increase dot damage by not allowing us to use orbs without adding dot damage
 

Grz

Reader
Platform
  1. Android
The words of one who outran the truth ;).
You've been playing for so long it's impossible you would have no idea how(hence the chuckling emote). There's nothing complicated about attaining it, hence the correct call 2 posts above being one of the most important factor, plus all the other obvious stats.
 
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