Damon Otter

Mad Otter Games
Developer
Hi Everyone,
The Raid Structure has been simplified and improved. In the course of this, the playbalance will have likely changed.

Please let us know if each of the current Tiers, Bronze, Silver, etc., are too challenging or too easy. We can adjust them.

Also, the new system relies on Dungeoneering for balance, so you will want to keep your Dungeoneering level up. It can really help.

Best, Damon
 
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Giruv

Merchant
Characters
Verrier
Platform
PC
Would love Heroic tier to be a little harder, previously I struggle doing level 46 rookery solo, right now solo run of Heroic 15 Rookery feels like a walk in the park.
 
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Jytal

Servant of Mallok
Platform
iOS
I was helping some people through some bronze tier raids. I am getting 0 dungeoneering exp for the entire raid, including the raid completion.
The gear, combat exp, and copper is already bad, why is dungeoneering 0 as well? The tier system was supposed bring the community together and be able to get raids together so why is it being discouraged to help others?
Did silver as was getting 12 dungeoneering exp, it's low but, it being low was expected. 0 dungeoneering exp is just flat out wrong.
 
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Halleebell

Squirrel
Characters
Hallee/Freyra
Platform
iOS, PC
I was helping some people through some bronze tier raids. I am getting 0 dungeoneering exp for the entire raid, including the raid completion.
The gear, combat exp, and copper is already bad, why is dungeoneering 0 as well? The tier system was supposed bring the community together and be able to get raids together so why is it being discouraged to help others?
Did silver as was getting 12 dungeoneering exp, it's low but, it being low was expected. 0 dungeoneering exp is just flat out wrong.
Yea it’s not like a lvl 95 player helping a new player through the 30 zones. There’s still a lot of fighting and healing resources being used 0 doesn’t seem right.
 
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sirbabbo

Citizen
Platform
Android
Lilith is way overboard with the 4 spawns she has when she does her dance that stops you if you don’t move and then covers the floor. If she doesn’t stop you and you move the 4 spawns still kill ya in gold for melee classes.
 
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Roak

Squirrel
Platform
PC
Last edited
Would love Heroic tier to be a little harder, previously I struggle doing level 46 rookery solo, right now solo run of Heroic 15 Rookery feels like a walk in the park.
How? I got my butt kicked at platinum,didnt even reached Lilith xD

I agree that raids now could use a little buff, but i do like how they are now easy enough to be played and enjoyed by more than 7 people on the server.It might be too easy for those 7 now, but i'm happy that i am now able to raids with other people (since the elite isnt always available to help).
 
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KAVE

Adventurer
Royal Guardian
Characters
See Signature
Platform
PC
Last edited
I know some are saying that Raids are too easy now, and that may be the case for certain tiers - but I don't think that increasing the health and damage scaling is the right solution. I would rather see additional objectives, mechanics and bosses that require players to strategize and groups to coordinate for specific encounters. The reason it feels easy is because we are allowed to skip most every combat encounter in the Raid besides a handful and the only objectives are pulling levers or clicking on objects. So if increased difficulty is needed, let it come in the form of mechanics rather than additional health and damage scaling.

Spruce up some existing bosses that need some love like the Red Prince. Add some objectives for groups that require them to split up and perform tasks in unison. Require a few more bounties in zones such as Woods where every bounty can be bypassed. Maybe add randomized zone buffs or player debuffs - or dynamic zone events that can cause a route to become blocked or open a brand new route.

Simply increasing health and damage of enemies results in players skipping more encounters for the sake of time. Raids are at their best when players have to slow down and organize their team for specific scenarios, such as dividing resources and sending multiple squads after certain objectives or prioritizing a series of obstacles to tackle as a group.
 

Giruv

Merchant
Characters
Verrier
Platform
PC
How? I got my butt kicked at platinum,didnt even reached Lilith xD
I think the enemy damage is okay. For me the issue is the disparity between the spell damage and auto attack damage. I feel like their spell damage is really high while their auto attack is a bit too low. Mob spell damage can dp more than triple their auto attack damage, so for the most part the hard part is surviving the first few hit, but if you can survive the first onslaught the rest is easy. Probably you'll notice Rookery and Cloister might be on the harder side because they have lots of spellcaster, while Swamp and Woods is way easier to survive because for the most part they just auto attack.
I agree that raids now could use a little buff, but i do like how they are now easy enough to be played and enjoyed by more than 7 people on the server.It might be too easy for those 7 now, but i'm happy that i am now able to raids with other people (since the elite isnt always available to help).
I think leaving bronze-platinum as it is fine since it make raid can be enjoyed by more player, while just bumping up the difficulty in the Heroic portion since it is made for those that want to push their limit. I feel like with how strong dungeoneering is right now, the heroic portion can be like season one where it is just an endless grind till the end.
I know some are saying that Raids are too easy now, and that may be the case for certain tiers - but I don't think that increasing the health and damage scaling is the right solution.
I totally agree with you and definetly prefer more mechanical difficulty, but right now I think some health bump is in order, because I feel the enemy die very fast especially if you got a heavy hitter. Like Amelia died just after her first egg, Magwood died on the second/third cast of Mana Maggot or Ravelle died just after one clone or sometime none at all, these bosses has some pretty cool mechanic, but they just don't have time to showcase their ability.
The reason it feels easy is because we are allowed to skip most every combat encounter in the Raid besides a handful and the only objectives are pulling levers or clicking on objects. So if increased difficulty is needed, let it come in the form of mechanics rather than additional health and damage scaling.
I'm the type of player that will never leave any enemy alive in my path(I love slaughtering them all), even then today most of the raid I did has ~15 minutes left on the clock and it is on Heroic 15+.
 
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Vita

Priest
Platform
Android
My experience from running multiple plat group and solo raids is that raids feel much more fair now. Bosses were tweaked and feel much better now especially prince and ravelle. Rook feels complete now with the new objectives and tweaks to getting to golden hammer.

I barely managed gold in the previous iteration but the climb was very frustrating due mostly due to time constraints. Randomness in a time-limited event that can end runs (damage resist affixes) is just bad design imo so I am glad the timers were changed to 30mins. Failing a raid due to time because you made a mistake and died feels much fairer than running out of time due to mobs being too tanky.

Damage and health scaling wise for solo feels very fair. At plat, I can still easily die even with 5star defenses if I get mobbed but its fair because a well-timed trinket immunity or burst damage can down a mob making the fight manageable. mobs having lower health rewards more tactical play which is achievable by all classes and levels.

In terms of group scaling, I think it needs to be increased quite significantly. Plat solo health scaling is 333% but group scaling is only at 2000+% where you can have up to 15 people. I think it should be bumped up to at least 3.5k or 4k%. Right now mobs die too quickly in group raids. Either that or add more objectives in group raids. Maybe make it so that 6 man raids have 3 additional objectives, 15 man raids have like 6 more objectives or something.

In terms of overall difficulty, I can see how level 95s might feel its too easy. The power level difference between a level 95 and non-95 is very big. I am not a level 95 and last iteration I barely reached gold with close to a fully optimized build whereas 95s can readily reach plat. For a non-95 the current scaling is fine but maybe they can add another level of scaling for 95s like give mobs x2 more damage and x3 health or something. Not sure how to implement that especially in group raids but the bonuses provided by 95 stuff do need to be considered in scaling as well.
 
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WaveChild

Citizen
Platform
iOS, PC
I love the changes — as a level 91, not totally spec’d out fire mage, I can run in 15 person raids, have fun and feel like I am contributing. If the goal was to make challenging content for level 20‘s & up, then judging from the number of raids & chat discussion on US3, you have succeeded. More lower level characters are participating. So thanks for the changes
 

Klaeklae

Bog Frog
Platform
Android
I think leaving bronze-platinum as it is fine since it make raid can be enjoyed by more player, while just bumping up the difficulty in the Heroic portion since it is made for those that want to push their limit. I feel like with how strong dungeoneering is right now, the heroic portion can be like season one where it is just an endless grind till the end.
This.

I think it's ok (and even needed) to have a small part of the raid system that can have "end game" challenge without worrying that everyone not end game geared and/ or not adept at their class would have a bad time..
Something worthy of an "enter at your own risk" mantra.

Sometimes overcoming the struggle of accomplishing the really challenging stuff is what creates that lasting depth that keeps players drawn in.

But also: Some famcy rewards wouldn't be horrible either. =)

-Klaeklae
 

sirbabbo

Citizen
Platform
Android
I understand a new patch is coming out but right now a lot of people in my guild our upset that it’s way too hard to do a platinum run. I feel like there is more of a toxicity over raids now then there was. You have on one hand people who got all the raids done saying it’s easy and now pointing fingers at others to get over it. Over hand have people wanting to do raids but can’t progress due to the difficulty.

A better solution in my opinion is to have the clock set to gold tier, silver tier and bronze tier. So every tier is a different drop for relics and gear, but also each tier would decrease the level of power. If you get all 10 bronze raids at bronze tier you get a different reward to the10 bronze raids at gold level. This can be selected before the raid so that way you can have an easier raid or a more difficult raid.

I think too many people want a lot of things but if the vast majority of the communityis complaining how difficult it is, that should overrule the ones that say suck it buttercup. Not trying to create a hostile post just a mere observation of how this raid is Going right now.

Me personally I’m a solo player and I find each character of my toons way too hard. Some are more for group player and others solo. Wizards, Sharmans and priests can build a hybrid class while a hunter and warrior cannot. Seems a hybrid class is better suited then classes that don’t offer the hybrid choice. I’m not here to get a free pass but I feel like we need to make raids more like the old dungeon runs and have it where it can be you chose how you want to run, like easy, medium and hard and then maybe insane.
 

Zaphyra

Wizard
Characters
Zaphyra
Platform
Android, PC
Last edited
Level 60 Fire Wiz (on 4th rebirth) using a Magic Find build and maxed gear... casual/nub raider, just sharing my feedback. :geek:

Yesterday I ran Gold Cloister and Swamp with my guild... died a couple times, still finished both raids... earned a Blue relic and Purple robe... and had more fun, than in the previous raid system. For me, the old system felt too grindy and the new system moves more quickly. 🤩(y)

I also agree with KAVE... I'd like to see Bronze, Gold and Platinum made more challenging... by adding puzzles, group objectives and boss mechanics, that require strategy and coordination. This way, players of all classes and gear quality, can compete and learn to enjoy raiding. 🤝

I also agree with players who want more of a strength challenge... I'd like to see the Heroic modes require the same strategy and coordination, but with even stronger mobs/bosses... so it really requires a strong group or very strong solo player, to survive. This way, those who make the effort to build their strongest characters, have something challenging to work towards and bragging rights, if/when they make the leader board. 💪

Those are my thoughts, ty for reading. 😘
 

Zazie

BRA Member
Royal Guardian
Characters
Zazie, Shiny, Skip, Auntie
Platform
PC
For me, the old system felt too grindy and the new system moves more quickly. 🤩(y)
I'm a very casual level 95 raider. Have done some only on my hunter. Haven't even attempted them on any of my other 3 toons (primarily cause I don't really want to get the combat XP on those toons and am only focusing on my hunter's elder levels atm.)

I agree about the grindiness of the old raids 100%. I don't really care if I can complete a silver raid, let alone anything beyond that. The relics I can get at bronze are handy for any combat that my hunter participates in outside of the raid. That's good enough for me!!

I've only done 2 person raids so far, but if a casual, easy-going, PUG happens (either bronze or silver), I might just be tempted to join in. :)

Platinum and heroic raids are NOT of interest to me in the least, but being able to do bronze (and maybe silver) is!! So in other words, platinum and heroic raids are meant for those players who are looking for the biggest challenge possible.
 
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Katniss Everdeen

Eldritch Huntress
Royal Guardian
Characters
Wendy & Song Merrydance
Platform
PC
I love the changes. For those that say it's too easy, try doing it on a hunter. I tried to solo the new raids and it isn't possible. Wasn't possible on the old raids either. Fortunately, I like running in a group.
I had given up on going for the platinum because, even in a group, it wasn't fun. Often, we'd run out of time just short of killing the final boss. Love that we have more time.
For those toons that find it too easy, scale them back in the zone so their power is comparable to the hunters. It's a fun thing to do now.
 

Nestor Power

Reader
Platform
PC, Steam
With the new patch, the balance of the raid has changed, which lasted 1-2 days. I played platinum level and multiplier was 500% more health and 333% more damage (solo). It got easier than it was , but still had to use half or full heals sometimes. I finished each raid 2-3 times on platinum and it was acceptable.
The next day I did not understand what had happened, but I was unable to complete the raid 4 times in a row. They changed the difficulty, but the multiplier remained the same. Only today it changed and became 700% more health and 700% more damage on platinum. What is it? On the forum, 2-3 people wrote that raids became too easy and you changed the difficulty for them? How about others? The damage has become more than 2 times on platinum level. I suspect they are playing on warrior or priest. These classes by themselves have % block from all enemy attacks, and with an epic or legendary relic with dodge another 20-25%. They block almost half of the damage. Of course it will be too easy for them. I play on a hunter 95 with 5 rebirths, all equipments are legendary with a maximum runes. Practically nothing to improve or it will not play a big role. Now health goes away so quickly (even with 5 glory charges) that I physically do not have time to control abilities, except for health elixirs, so as not to die, which doesn't help much now. Do you test the balance yourself or only listen to those who play with the best raid class?
I do not want to say what would you do the raid too easy so that even players with weak gear can did it. I want the balance to be fair for all classes. And every class if he has good equipment, potions and tactics could complete the raid on high level. And I'm not talking about potions from Red Darrig. I think they should be optional as help for those who are not yet have the good equipment and make a mistakes.
 

Lalocat

Hunter
Characters
Lalocat
Platform
Android, PC
The next day I did not understand what had happened, but I was unable to complete the raid 4 times in a row. They changed the difficulty, but the multiplier remained the same. Only today it changed and became 700% more health and 700% more damage on platinum. What is it? On the forum, 2-3 people wrote that raids became too easy and you changed the difficulty for them?
Maybe it's related to making Heroic impossible on purpose while they are fixing an exploit there. It messed up all the raid levels, not just Heroic?
 
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Sinjin

Jack Of All Trades
Platform
iOS
Sometimes (and I won’t say that’s happening here), you roll up on a really fugly affix (or sometimes, a really bad combination of affixes) that will cause a raid fail.
 
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